Brexit and moving London forward

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London voted to stay in the European Union, but the country voted to leave. The coming months will bring the start of negotiations that will steer its way forwards through a ‘Brexit’ process and beyond.

Membership of the European Union meant access to the single market - meaning no trade restrictions or tariffs and free movement of services, goods and people between the UK and member countries. What follows could therefore shape future trade, establishment, investment and possibly civic life in general in the capital.

What do you think are the key issues for the capital through this negotiation process and beyond? What are the conditions needed for London to move forward with the UK no longer part of the European Union? How can we unite to build towards a strong future for the capital?

The discussion ran from 28 June 2016 - 28 September 2016

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Comments (547)

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It seems to me that it is in everybody's interests to have a calm and collective conference to bring back stability to UK connection with Europe and the rest of the world. The centre ground needs to be re-established as soon as possible...

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It seems to me that it is in everybody's interests to have a calm and collective conference to bring back stability to UK connection with Europe and the rest of the world. The centre ground needs to be re-established as soon as possible. Where are the statesmen that can achieve this?

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We don't have statespeople any more. I suspect that they were artificial constructs, avatars made by spin and media, and by the right clothes and facial expression.

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we need to keep free movement of labour, I work in NHS and more than 10% of staff in my trust are non british EU nationals (not sure how Irish or dual nationals were counted). least bad outcome s doing a norway, pay to stay but have no say

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Mayor Khan could keep a very close eye on the property investment situation. While Brexit may cause house prices to drop, it could also cause Housing Associations to put their rents up very high indeed when their property portfolio value...

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Mayor Khan could keep a very close eye on the property investment situation. While Brexit may cause house prices to drop, it could also cause Housing Associations to put their rents up very high indeed when their property portfolio value drops. Already key workers have been driven out of Peabody ex-Crown homes by rent rises because the Mayoral Key Workers housing subsidy ended. London needs a new key workers housing subsidy scheme, plus a definite powerful programme of building homes for social rent, plus homes for ordinary London workers to buy. This should be the priority for public land. Yet look at what Westminster City Council did with the land it owned at Clevedon Street - the developers got out of providing any social rent or affordable homes AND wriggled out of providing funds for social rent homes to be built elsewhere. This was done in secret, but after legal challenge it was ruled to be in the public interest for the information to be released. This must NOT happen again.

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Avatar for - Monarch butterfly

We can unite first of all by acknowledging that we are all part of the same UK. So a little less about how London voted differently from the rest of the UK might be helpful.

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I don't see why. It is better to have the differences out in the open and resolve them than to pretend they don't exist. The UK has different regions and different cities, all with their own characteristics and identities. If, and it is...

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I don't see why. It is better to have the differences out in the open and resolve them than to pretend they don't exist. The UK has different regions and different cities, all with their own characteristics and identities. If, and it is very unlikely indeed to happen, we were to get some kind of free city state status, we would still be part of the UK.

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The Leave campaign was fraudulent.
The referendum was severely flawed by biased media coverage such as the Daily Mail.
More than four million people have posted a petition to hold a second, proper referendum.
I hope the incoming Prime...

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The Leave campaign was fraudulent.
The referendum was severely flawed by biased media coverage such as the Daily Mail.
More than four million people have posted a petition to hold a second, proper referendum.
I hope the incoming Prime Minister will think again.

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Even though it was only an advisory referendum, there is no chance of the next PM thinking again. Unless there is a massive campaign by millions of people to make it happen.

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I think that's the point though; there are many people on this forum claiming that we must respect the democratic will of the people, but in doing so, they are conflating the act of voting with democracy itself.

The Brexit campaign (and...

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I think that's the point though; there are many people on this forum claiming that we must respect the democratic will of the people, but in doing so, they are conflating the act of voting with democracy itself.

The Brexit campaign (and the Chilcot Enquiry) should have highlighted to any objective observer that democracy in this country has severely been damaged by politicians failing to operate in good faith. This started, to a great extent, with Blair and his duplicitous attitude towards Iraq, and has since been continued with Osborne's inaccurate reporting of the fiscal performance and challenges faced by the country, and reached an overwhelming level when it came to the lies and deceit of the Brexit Campaign (with many of the Leavers' promises being retreated from within hours of the vote), all of which has been achieved with clear support from the mainstream media.

To be clear, while I initially started as an "undecided leaning towards leaver" and eventually, after significant research, voted to remain, I would not have a problem with the outcome of the vote - had the campaigns been run in good faith, with the intention of properly informing the electorate... but it should be clear to anyone that this was not the case, given that the electorate was asked to vote on an unspecified idea with unspecified outcomes and what limited information was provided (e.g. £350m/week to the EU/£350m/week extra for the NHS), was flagged up as incorrect from the start of the campaign.

Democracy fails to be an effective tool for governance when the electorate is ill or (deliberately) misinformed and is unable to hold the government and individual politicians to account for operating in bad faith.

I suggest that criminal charges should be raised under Misconduct in Public Office laws against Gove, Boris and Farage for their misrepresentation of the truth for personal gain, against Cameron for calling the election for personal gain (to regain control of his party) and against the public interest and against the Directors of the mainstream media whose editorial briefs allowed for deliberate falsehoods to be propagated... And after that, we can raise charges against Osborne for misrepresenting the evidence concerning the economy and against Blair for his handling of the Iraq War...

(Having reviewed the legal situation on Misconduct in Public Office (http://goo.gl/2X9rj8) I believe that in almost all these cases it would be hard to argue that these individuals are not criminally culpable under this law).

If the elected representatives fail to represent the interests of the electorate in good faith and cannot be held to account for their behaviour then democracy cannot be used as an effective tool for governance. As such, in order to stem the failures of the government, we should act collectively to resolve these issues, and seek to hold the individuals criminally culpable for the damages they have inflicted upon the population.

I strongly suspect that after a few of these individuals had been held to account before a court, we'd very quickly see that the kinds of behaviours that have led to politicians being held in such low esteem within the electorate would very quickly disappear...

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We need to unite to capitalise on the tremendous, new opportunities whereby London & the UK can negotiate its own trade deals. It is essential that we capitalise on the Commonwealth links to develop a new, Commonwealth free trade zone able...

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We need to unite to capitalise on the tremendous, new opportunities whereby London & the UK can negotiate its own trade deals. It is essential that we capitalise on the Commonwealth links to develop a new, Commonwealth free trade zone able to rival the EU.

Acting with speed (not haste) this opportunity can strengthen our position when negotiating with the self centred EU dictacrats that have little regard for national interests (or indeed London's). Remember, even now, within the EU, we do not have full and free trade in certain financial products. Yet, despite this, London thrives,

Yes, at the time of the vote I was slightly in favour of a Brexit; however the actions and feedback from the EU since has clarified my view - we can, will and must be outside this misguided organisation.

The UK has made a nationwide democratic choice, or are some suggesting that next time my electoral ward votes contrary to the rest of the Borough we should apply for independence!

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I believe NZ has made a suggestion for a Commonwealth agreement, but most Commonwealth countries are well into trade agreements with the EU at the moment.

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I believe NZ has made a suggestion for a Commonwealth agreement, but most Commonwealth countries are well into trade agreements with the EU at the moment.

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Avatar for - Monarch butterfly

The New Zealand case is interesting - some time after we joined the Common Market I was given a ticking-off by a New Zealander who told me how selfish Britain was to join the Common Market and abandon the countries of the Commonwealth...

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The New Zealand case is interesting - some time after we joined the Common Market I was given a ticking-off by a New Zealander who told me how selfish Britain was to join the Common Market and abandon the countries of the Commonwealth. There's life and goodwill in the Commonwealth.

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We used to have cheap butter from NZ. I think it hit their farming economy hard when we joined the Common Market.

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Why there are always numbers of peaple coming to UK but no number of people coming back to their countries because they cannot stand the low quality of life in here?

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I have known some return to their home countries or go elsewhere in Europe. For some it was specifically the low quality NHS here that was the deciding factor - they returned to eastern Europe & better quality healthcare.

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The City provides a very significant contribution of foreign currency. We must make very endeavour to maintain that position, Frankfurt and Paris will try very hard to take this dominance from us.

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Already Paris, Frankfurt, Warsaw, Dublin, Berlin, and more capital cities are putting together offer packages to tempt City businesses to abandon London. The Mayor will be doing what he can to counter this attack.

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The key issues is that we move forward together ensuring that the voice of the people is heard and that we don't send mixed messages. Many who voted leave did so due to concerns related to the political leadership of the EU rather than...

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The key issues is that we move forward together ensuring that the voice of the people is heard and that we don't send mixed messages. Many who voted leave did so due to concerns related to the political leadership of the EU rather than immigration concerns. It is important that this is recognised because many are concerned that we are racist because we as a nation voted leave. There are, of course, sadly those that voted leave for racist or xenophobic reasons but they are in the minority and we must fight this notion and do all that we can to ensure European nations understand that we are not against them.

It is also vital that those EU citizens that currently reside and work in the UK are given assurance that they will not be made to return to their home nation as a result of Brexit. They must remain welcome and be encouraged to continue contributing to the UK society and economy if that is there wish.

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For the last years, spaniards stopped putting our first language on the skill list on our cvs in order to get further in recruitment processes, in which way can we feel that we can move from Starbucks towards a job in our chosen profession...

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For the last years, spaniards stopped putting our first language on the skill list on our cvs in order to get further in recruitment processes, in which way can we feel that we can move from Starbucks towards a job in our chosen profession and hepl this city to enrich it?
Thank you for comment anyway...

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Have another referendum and it will reverse the previous one. Because of all the lies portrayed by the out hoodwinked the voters

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The Leave Campaign MPs should resign on the grounds that they deliberately mislead the electorate.
THE BOARD - Chair: Rt Hon Gisela Stuart, Nigel Dodds, Bernard Jenkin, Graham Stringer MP, Anne-Marie Trevelyan.
THE COMMITTEE: Rt Hon...

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The Leave Campaign MPs should resign on the grounds that they deliberately mislead the electorate.
THE BOARD - Chair: Rt Hon Gisela Stuart, Nigel Dodds, Bernard Jenkin, Graham Stringer MP, Anne-Marie Trevelyan.
THE COMMITTEE: Rt Hon Michael Gove, Frank Field, Rt Hon Iain Duncan Smith, Liam Fox, Rt Hon John Whittingdale, Rt Hon Theresa Villiers, Rt Hon Priti Patel, Andrea Leadsom, Boris Johnson, Steve Baker, Dan Hannan MEP. It was the Committee that set the strategy week by week.

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For Higher Education the access to free movement and EU funding has been extremely fruitful. We should aim at staying as close to the EU as possible (and ideally make it easier for non-EU people to get visas).

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Has anyone pointed out that too many of the media and others called it a Brexit vote instead of referring to the vote as a Referendum. That put wrong ideas into some peoples' minds.
The media should be @shot@ for this inaccuracy.

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I have worked for global corporates who operate internal employee recruitment, rotation schemes, placements or other programmes for employees to move around within the company and live in another country, either permanently or temporarily....

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I have worked for global corporates who operate internal employee recruitment, rotation schemes, placements or other programmes for employees to move around within the company and live in another country, either permanently or temporarily. This is very attractive and supports employees in their career development, personal and family life, but also works for businesses as they benefit from diverse viewpoints and experiences. I have many friends from other EU countries who live and work in London, plus British friends who live and work in other EU countries - which has also been one of my own career ambitions.
My friends are now very concerned about what Brexit may mean for them personally and whether they will be able to stay in the country where they currently live, work and have started a family. Brexit has in effect pulled the rug from under their feet and they feel incredibly destabilised. One friend has already started to look for work outside of the UK and others are applying for passports from other EU countries. I am concerned that there will be a new 'brain drain' and that talented people will leave the UK, leaving holes in businesses, schools and the NHS. Neighbourhood communities would loose friends, skills, culture and diversity.
Since the start of the recession in 2008, I have twice been made redundant as a direct result of the recession and have only been able to acquire a series of short term contract roles. I am currently unemployed looking for my next role, which ideally would be long term permanent. I am highly skilled, experienced and educated, yet my career has not recovered from 2008. I am concerned that there will be a new wave of recession cut backs and that competition for even fewer jobs will be even fiercer. I am anxious that I will never be in full-time permanent employment again and that I may have to move into shared rental accommodation. I am 44 years old and petrified about my future.
The key issues for me are:
free movement of people
recruitment legislation
job prospects
growing economy/recession

I think faith, charity and community groups have the potential to contribute to building a strong hopeful future for London and the UK, starting in the local community. I think all MPs need to urgently hold open forums to engage local people in the issues that matter to them and to explore the reasons why people voted the way they did. Maybe there are lessons that can be learned in London that can be taken to other parts of the country. I think London needs to urgently celebrate being European - our geographical closeness to the continent has not changed. I also think that London, meaning those in positions of authority in the local government, central government, the media, business and residents, need to realise that they live in a bubble - their experience and views are not the experience and views of the rest of the nation, as such, they should not be portrayed in any news media channel as the de facto experience and views of state of the nation - they aren't. Neither should other towns and cities be forced to duplicate London, each town has its own personality. London is not like a perfect McDonalds to be duplicated and planted everywhere with no customisation. However, there are lessons that could be shared with other towns as starting points for discussion.

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I have little doubt that London will remain among the most attractive cities in the world in which to work and spend leisure time. Its diversity is virtually unparalleled anywhere else and thease of travel is huge.

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While a believer in remaining, we are where we are. Brexit has the potential to be a disaster for both the UK and the remainder of the EU. It is to be hoped that a toned down version will come out of the discussions. I feel that the vote...

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While a believer in remaining, we are where we are. Brexit has the potential to be a disaster for both the UK and the remainder of the EU. It is to be hoped that a toned down version will come out of the discussions. I feel that the vote actually showed how detached the rest of the country is from London. It is essential that London now has independance from the rest of the UK. If 5.5 Million Scots can have a vote for independence then so can the 8-9 million Londoners. This will allow London to become a major City state, with attractive tax rates. Naturally London will need people from the surrounding areas to work in its businesses and to supply it with food and goods. This income will support the surrounding areas as now but it will be clearer where that money comes from. London will then be in a position to affiliate with the EU as a city state.

It is essential that a detailed plan for London Independance be drawn up with haste as there are many considerations and things to plan for.

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First we have to have a good Prime Minister, nothing should be rushed, think about what we are doing, what we want and get the best deal fo UK. And remember brexit means brexit, I don't mind free movement for work but do not come here if...

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First we have to have a good Prime Minister, nothing should be rushed, think about what we are doing, what we want and get the best deal fo UK. And remember brexit means brexit, I don't mind free movement for work but do not come here if you do not have a job and a place to live.

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In 1963 I wrote a thesis explaining that Britain should developed a trading block with the Commonwealth and then trade with the EU. Since Brexit have won the referendum, then the Brexiters should be made to pay the billions of losses to...

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In 1963 I wrote a thesis explaining that Britain should developed a trading block with the Commonwealth and then trade with the EU. Since Brexit have won the referendum, then the Brexiters should be made to pay the billions of losses to the pound, industry and commerce. All the leading Brexiters are on the run. They have done the damage and they are devoid of the backbone to take responsibility for their mess.

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The referendum was non binding & parliamentary approval is needed. It's a pity no politicians have the gumption to say that.

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Clearly, the Brexit vote from London suggests a desire to remain in the EU, and there is an impression from the response of the electorate to the overall decision to leave that many people who voted leave now regret their decision.

With...

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Clearly, the Brexit vote from London suggests a desire to remain in the EU, and there is an impression from the response of the electorate to the overall decision to leave that many people who voted leave now regret their decision.

With the Leave campaign pushing falsehoods throughout the process, stepping back from promises almost immediately after the vote and having no plan following the outcome, it seems clear that while the vote went towards Leave, there is no democratic mandate for any specific actions towards the final outcome.

Many people have suggested a need for a General Election to be held to give Parliament a mandate to execute the Leave (or not), a second referendum once the specific details on the leave negotiations become clear, or, more drastically, some way for London to secede from the wider UK.

While I'm not entirely keen on the idea of London leaving the UK, but I suspect we would see better governance with London as a separate entity, and if the government refuses to recognise the desire within the electorate for a re-assessment of the validity of the vote to leave, once people are more informed about the specific outcomes of Brexit, I would absolutely prefer to see London exit the UK than for the UK to exit the EU.

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Avatar for - Monarch butterfly

Like your opinion.

Avatar for - American pika

London has shown itself to be quite different from most of the rest of the UK not least in its internationalism, liberalism, level of education and economic success.
Germany used to host free & imperial cities that ran their own affairs...

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London has shown itself to be quite different from most of the rest of the UK not least in its internationalism, liberalism, level of education and economic success.
Germany used to host free & imperial cities that ran their own affairs quite separate from the surrounding territories but were under the nominal supervision of the far distant Emperor and some prospered mightily (Basel, Strasburg, Koln).
Could this not be a model for a modern free city-state, a member of the EU in its own right but on good terms with the surrounding rump-UK?

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The wording of the question is where adjustments need to be made first. It repeatedly mentions London as being separate from the UK. It isn't separate, it is part of the UK, and has to accept that first. Then it must work as hard as usual...

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The wording of the question is where adjustments need to be made first. It repeatedly mentions London as being separate from the UK. It isn't separate, it is part of the UK, and has to accept that first. Then it must work as hard as usual, to maintain the current businesses and financial entities, and every other form of commercial enterprise, that currently exists. New agreements will probably be needed, but that's about all. Just carry on as before but remembering that London is part of the UK, not separate from it.

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London is an integral part of the UK. Poor ole 'remnants' not being part of London - shame!

Avatar for - American pika

Haven't recent events shown that the UK itself is probably a concept with a distinctly limited shelf-life - with the Scots and even the Northern Irish considering secession, not least because of the moves towards Brexit and their desire to...

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Haven't recent events shown that the UK itself is probably a concept with a distinctly limited shelf-life - with the Scots and even the Northern Irish considering secession, not least because of the moves towards Brexit and their desire to remain 'In'?
It could be argued that London has just as distinct an identity as either and similar rights to secede should the residents so wish.
It would be up to the EU members to decide which, if any, UK fragments they would like to accept and on what terms.

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Clearly London felt very differently on this and, I believe, other issues. We should have greater devolved autonomy for London. There are so many ways we differ from the rest of England and the UK - diversity, property prices, salary...

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Clearly London felt very differently on this and, I believe, other issues. We should have greater devolved autonomy for London. There are so many ways we differ from the rest of England and the UK - diversity, property prices, salary, transport, etc, and that should be recognised and respected, with more powers for the Mayor and London Assembly.

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I would want to be cautious about asking more for London. It already sucks in huge amounts of money and talent (and, to be fair, gives some of it back) that, as the capital, it should have a care for the rest of the UK.

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I would want to be cautious about asking more for London. It already sucks in huge amounts of money and talent (and, to be fair, gives some of it back) that, as the capital, it should have a care for the rest of the UK.

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London, per se, does not have the power to do much for the rest of the UK. We have the London Assembly and the Mayor and their briefs are to look after London; other cities have their metropolitan authorities.

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London, per se, does not have the power to do much for the rest of the UK. We have the London Assembly and the Mayor and their briefs are to look after London; other cities have their metropolitan authorities.

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