London's recovery starts with you

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618 Londoners have responded | 07/08/2020 - 01/10/2020

London's recovery starts with you

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A Green New Deal

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The UK low carbon and environmental goods and services sector (green economy) is worth £40 billion in sales and employs nearly 250,000 people. It is worth more to the London economy than the construction and manufacturing sectors combined. Putting the environment at the centre of London’s recovery offers an opportunity to reverse the looming economic downturn by bringing new investment to London, helping businesses to see long-term growth, and providing decent, skilled, local jobs. Protecting and investing in the environment will also improve the health of all Londoners. Read more about the context for this mission.
 
Mission: “Increase the size of London’s green economy by 2030 to accelerate job creation and to drive a fair and inclusive recovery from COVID-19 that tackles the climate emergency, eradicates air pollution and builds long-term, community-led resilience.”
 
We’ll need to work together so that:

  • Short term - there's a rapid increase in Londoners acquiring the skills needed to access green jobs as well as increase investment in the sector
  • Medium term - making transport, buildings, public realm and lifestyles more environmentally friendly
  • Long term - we become a zero pollution city by 2030 and zero waste city by 2050

 
Areas of focus might include:

  • Scaling up energy and adaptation programmes to retrofit buildings and accelerate community and renewable energy projects
  • Developing safe, connected cycling and walking routes, and support a shift away from cars to public transport
  • Funding communities to increase green spaces and support low carbon and circular economy businesses

 
What do you think of this mission? Is there anything critical to London’s recovery missing from this mission? What does this mean for you personally and your community? What actions or interventions would have the most impact? How will we know that we’ve succeeded?  Who has a role to play to meet this challenge?   

The discussion ran from 07 August 2020 - 01 October 2020

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Comments (332)

Avatar for - Saola
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I fully support these aims. I don't agree with others that 20 MPH zones increase pollution. What does pollute is the bad driving I see regularly with lots of unnecessary acceleration, tail-gating, speeding well over the limit and other...

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I fully support these aims. I don't agree with others that 20 MPH zones increase pollution. What does pollute is the bad driving I see regularly with lots of unnecessary acceleration, tail-gating, speeding well over the limit and other aggressive driving. If drivers are unable to behave the punishment should be to permanently disqualify them.

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Avatar for - Koala
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Sharing with you some fairly easy ideas to implement 

1) catchy campaigns on food and waste reduction

2) Londonwide easy to understand recycling system

3)education on the importance of keeping London's private gardens as opposed to back...

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Sharing with you some fairly easy ideas to implement 

1) catchy campaigns on food and waste reduction

2) Londonwide easy to understand recycling system

3)education on the importance of keeping London's private gardens as opposed to back garden development and paved over front gardens

4)car free areas round inner city schools

5) rubbish tax on takeaways that use unsustainable packaging

6) fines for littering and maybe a Keep London Tidy campaign 

7)London-wide statistics on food production (Bengalis in TH grow tones of food) to understand different communities use of private outdoor space  to encourage more urban horticulture

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Avatar for - Rhino
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Great ideas Towerhamelette!

 

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Great ideas Towerhamelette!

 

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I fully agree with point number 7.  Sometime ago I was reading that London soil is not suitable for growing as it may contain toxic particles. Anyone has ever found out if this is true?

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I fully agree with point number 7.  Sometime ago I was reading that London soil is not suitable for growing as it may contain toxic particles. Anyone has ever found out if this is true?

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Avatar for - Colombian spotted frog
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Would generally support this but what about those who live further out and cannot cycle? Id like to see an assessment of exactly WHO we are encouraging to cycle and what the benefits are. Is there evidence that those on the roads are all...

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Would generally support this but what about those who live further out and cannot cycle? Id like to see an assessment of exactly WHO we are encouraging to cycle and what the benefits are. Is there evidence that those on the roads are all people who could and should cycle? E.g. is it a specific age group? Also what journeys are the most damaging? Is it professionals in the city cabbing around or general use of public transport. In the comms, be clearer about the specific challenge, why an intervention is necessary and how you will measure it. I can see the benefits right in the centre but for those of us in zone 4, it can become impractical. Also how will it impact small businesses in the centre?

Would also welcome more on recycling, composting and creating green spaces in central. 

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Avatar for -
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Road and Traffic management in London is well intended but hugely misguided

People still need to get around and across the city in vehicles. Encouraging cycling is good but benefits there have been eroded by the losses in traffic flow. No...

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Road and Traffic management in London is well intended but hugely misguided

People still need to get around and across the city in vehicles. Encouraging cycling is good but benefits there have been eroded by the losses in traffic flow. No infrastructure has been CREATED, we have simply reallocated existing infrastructure from motorists to cyclists. Robbing Peter to pay Paul in other words.

The explosion of 20mph limit areas is slowing traffic flow and actually causing MORE pollution. Id go for a 30mph limit and also look at the Australian school zone speed / traffic management whereby a lower speed limit (eg 20-25mph) is introduced in periods of risk ie when kids are going to and from school.

My fear is that the bold words of GREEN NEW DEAL sound so positive and appealing, however these initiatives can have negative consequences that need to be considered and counter balanced if present.

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Avatar for - Koala
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Short term/medium term vision should include a massive campaign to bring compost/food waste bins to homes and offices and educate people on how to use them correctly. We should be looking at other models in various countries that have this...

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Short term/medium term vision should include a massive campaign to bring compost/food waste bins to homes and offices and educate people on how to use them correctly. We should be looking at other models in various countries that have this incorporated into their recology programs and figure how to scale. This is a huge area of improvement that changes peoples' behaviours while having a direct impact on environmental outcomes, including the zero waste goal. If we can make it easier and more accessible for people to participate in this lifestyle change, including adding more jobs, we are doing an incredible part to address the green new deal. 

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Avatar for - Adelie penguin
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As much as it's nice to merely encourage people to cycle and walk more, part of the aim to get people traveling actively more should include de-incentivising driving - that means increasing fuel duty, charging more for parking, blocking rat...

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As much as it's nice to merely encourage people to cycle and walk more, part of the aim to get people traveling actively more should include de-incentivising driving - that means increasing fuel duty, charging more for parking, blocking rat runs, building more dutch roundabouts, closing off roads so that bikes and people can pass through but not cars, and no doubt other suggestions I haven't thought of.

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Avatar for - Sumatran elephant
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Who could disagree? But it is simply nice wishful thinking without money, powers and cross-party political agreement for action. The uproar across the country, including London, because of the sudden large increase in cycle lanes and...

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Who could disagree? But it is simply nice wishful thinking without money, powers and cross-party political agreement for action. The uproar across the country, including London, because of the sudden large increase in cycle lanes and occasionally larger pedestrian areas will be nothing compared with even greater restrictions on the use of cars, especially petrol/diesel ones. With Mayoral/GLA elections in 2021 and London councils in 2022. Very few politicians are will want to upset local car users, especially with Covid. A strong and skilled education and communication campaign is needed to better inform and persuade more people to accept the need to reduce car use ASAP. The actual measures needed; reducing road space for cars, lowering speed limits, reducing parking space or increasing charges, increased road use taxes, especially on carbon bad vehicles, such as SUVs, will be necessary, but bitterly opposed by many. Politicians will dither and delay. Much more effort must be put in to improving and increasing public transport and making it relatively cheaper. BUT FIRST we must convince people that it is safe to use and is the responsible public thing to do.

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Avatar for - Adelie penguin
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Strongly support this. How about London becoming a Doughnut City?! A fantastic tool for transformation and others are using it already : https://www.kateraworth.com/2020/04/08/amsterdam-city-doughnut/

 

 

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Strongly support this. How about London becoming a Doughnut City?! A fantastic tool for transformation and others are using it already : https://www.kateraworth.com/2020/04/08/amsterdam-city-doughnut/

 

 

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Avatar for -
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Car pollution needs to be reduced. Far more investment in needed in a network for charging electric cars - every lamp post? In the meantime the worst pollution is caused by the permanent traffic jams which seem to be deliberately caused in...

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Car pollution needs to be reduced. Far more investment in needed in a network for charging electric cars - every lamp post? In the meantime the worst pollution is caused by the permanent traffic jams which seem to be deliberately caused in a misplaced effort to reduce the attractiveness of car travel.

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Avatar for - Saola
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I am absolutely in favour of the strongest and most robust effort possible to implement a Green New Deal.  It is commendable you are considering doing this and it needs to be translated into action, not words.  Transforming the city from a...

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I am absolutely in favour of the strongest and most robust effort possible to implement a Green New Deal.  It is commendable you are considering doing this and it needs to be translated into action, not words.  Transforming the city from a car-orientated city to more cycle, pedestrian and public transit is good; if there are cars and trucks, they need to be fully electric, and the electricity generation needs to come from clean renewable sources.  This means a lot for me personally, and I have been very active around the climate emergency; I was involved with XR protests and made an apocalyptic concept album last year, proceeds from which went to XR; find out more here -> https://davidbarrows.com/albums/the-species-that-knew-too-much/   The pandemic provides an opportunity for a radical transformation of the economy.  Government at every level needs to get on board with this and act faster and with more urgency than ever.  Thanks.

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Avatar for - American pika
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These proposals are necessary and sensible, although details need to be worked out, as suggested by many of the other comments. A citizens assembly would be a good way of involving the public in this. Also very important not to be swayed by...

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These proposals are necessary and sensible, although details need to be worked out, as suggested by many of the other comments. A citizens assembly would be a good way of involving the public in this. Also very important not to be swayed by entrenched vested interests with loud voices, such as car drivers, builders and others who wish to return to business as usual.

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Avatar for - Tiger
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The ambition to achieve a zero waste city by 2050 is not sufficiently ambitious & doesn't adequately sustain migration towards a circular economy.  These policy initiatives are otherwise meaningless.

There is a poor understanding reflected...

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The ambition to achieve a zero waste city by 2050 is not sufficiently ambitious & doesn't adequately sustain migration towards a circular economy.  These policy initiatives are otherwise meaningless.

There is a poor understanding reflected in comments already submitted suggesting that improving facilities for light traffic, people, bikes, public transport & disabled/motability vehicles, along with service, commercial & utilities vehicles will be adversely impacted by strategic road improvements that reduce private car use. More needs to be done to explain how this need not be the case by an educational support unit.

 

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My 88 year old, partially sighted mother, refuses to swap her wheelchair for a bicycle. I have yet to see a 3 piece suite being delivered on a bicycle, nor a plumber with a boiler on the tube. How many deliveries by bicycle  would be needed...

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My 88 year old, partially sighted mother, refuses to swap her wheelchair for a bicycle. I have yet to see a 3 piece suite being delivered on a bicycle, nor a plumber with a boiler on the tube. How many deliveries by bicycle  would be needed to replenish the shelves of any supermarket?

Not everyone has a shower to use when they arrive at work, either hot and sweaty or cold and wet. 

10,000 years ago, it was possible to walk from what is now London to what is now Copenhagen or Paris. Then the icecaps melted. Nothing to do with man. This myth of 'man-made climate change' is an excuse to extort more tax from us for "green policies."

If you really believe that man is responsible for climate change, consume less and do not have children.

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Avatar for - Pangolin
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Reduce speed limits on all roads. Broaden congestion charge area. Vastly Increase number of electric car charging points. Don't build on green spaces only brownfield. Increase number of trees planted and consider making new parks and making...

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Reduce speed limits on all roads. Broaden congestion charge area. Vastly Increase number of electric car charging points. Don't build on green spaces only brownfield. Increase number of trees planted and consider making new parks and making existing ones bigger. Don't build over station car parks so less cars go into the centre or spend time driving around looking for street parking. 

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Safe, connected and connected walking and cycling routes are a wonderful start. Post-Covid the world has recognised that a lot more work can be done effectively from home, so we also need to make more provisions for folks to work, shop and...

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Safe, connected and connected walking and cycling routes are a wonderful start. Post-Covid the world has recognised that a lot more work can be done effectively from home, so we also need to make more provisions for folks to work, shop and be entertained near to where they live, rather than everyone commuting into central London. 

Employers should be encouraged to allow working from home and the chain restaurants closing in the centre of the city should get encouragement to move branches to the outer boroughs. Similarly instead of giant WeWorks and the like distorting office rent prices in central London, lets encourage more local working hubs that people don't have to travel an hour to get to from where they live. 

By definition, through traffic does nothing for the areas it passes through other than clog it up and cause pollution. We need a lot more low-traffic neighborhoods, restrict through traffic, and how about a 20mph speed limit default on all roads except dual-carriageway A roads throughout London? 

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I agree with previous comments - this is so important to be on the agenda, but it's not ambitious or radical enough. 'Supporting a shift away from cars' for example - people need to be forced to make significant changes, just look how...

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I agree with previous comments - this is so important to be on the agenda, but it's not ambitious or radical enough. 'Supporting a shift away from cars' for example - people need to be forced to make significant changes, just look how quickly pollution levels bounced back to normal levels once lockdown eased.

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Avatar for - Tiger
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In principle I favour this initiative, but it has to be reasonable and not radical for the majority of the general public to accept it, which is the only way it will have a chance of succeeding.  You confuse the issue at hand by mentioning...

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In principle I favour this initiative, but it has to be reasonable and not radical for the majority of the general public to accept it, which is the only way it will have a chance of succeeding.  You confuse the issue at hand by mentioning tackling the climate emergency in the mission statement.  I fully accept and encompass that climate change is happening, bet there is relatively little that human beings and society organisations can do to change this - all we can do is to make efforts to mitigate the change as far as we can.

'Zero waste' by any date whatsoever is a meaningless statement, as it is totally by nature that all living things - animals, plants and microbes - produce waste of some kind and every process of existing, living and working produces waste of some kind - no process whatsoever is 100% efficient, nor ever will be, simply by the laws of physics and chemistry.

Increased green environment and lower carbon footprint are excellent initiatives, as also are investment in jobs and renewable energy. However, being realistic, expecting people - both in London and across the world - to give up cars and take to bicycles and public transport is as absurd as expecting people to give up their mobile phones, social media, music, using computers, or going on holidays. Far more sensible to acommodate cars into our city and communities in a more social and green way, particularly as the population is ageing and increasing numbers cannot ride cycles or walk to do what they need to, especially as public transport will be too dangerous for many in the future, at least for the next few years. You have done virtually nothing to make the London underground Covid-safe.

 

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(adding to my last comment) I would also like to recommend that decision makers and forum commenters read into the work of The Leap Manifesto. The Leap Manifesto was devised collectively by a number of activists in North America, including...

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(adding to my last comment) I would also like to recommend that decision makers and forum commenters read into the work of The Leap Manifesto. The Leap Manifesto was devised collectively by a number of activists in North America, including Green New Deal campaigner Naomi Klein. The Leap Manifesto is the perfect blueprint for implementing widespread GND social/political/environmental/economic change. The Manifesto raises several important points. For example, the fact that GND jobs need to be framed and defined as not just jobs specifically about the environment; we need to have investment in zero-carbon forms of work such as the care sector. Think of how we could drastically reduce our carbon footprints, and improve the livelihoods of many, if we invested in and boosted jobs within the care sector, rather than relentless construction, minining, or capitalist office work. Care sector jobs (teaching, community initiatives, health and social care) are extremely low carbon, the sector is always in need of additional hands, and yet it is uninvested in. By adopting The Leap Manifesto's GND principles, such as the investment and steering of low-carbon (but not directly 'environmental') jobs, we can navigate the climate crisis with a much healthier society. 

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(adding to my last comment)

 

We need a radical overhaul of transport infrastructure, phasing out fossil fuels entirely from both private and public transport. We also need the mass implementation of cycling and other zero-carbon personal...

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(adding to my last comment)

 

We need a radical overhaul of transport infrastructure, phasing out fossil fuels entirely from both private and public transport. We also need the mass implementation of cycling and other zero-carbon personal vehicles. However, this can't be done through simply offering a one off voucher or adding an extra bike lane to a town. There needs to be a radical and systemic change. We need to see roads phasing out cars almost entirely in places (leaving cars only allowed if for accessibility purposes, for example, in high congestion areas). Bike lanes shouldn't be add ons, squeezed into existing road space: they need to become the roads. Also, proper cycling proficiency eduction needs to start from the ground up: when schools are safe again, compulsory cycling proficiency training in schools, to train the next generation of zero carbon commuters. 

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I am glad that a Green New Deal is on the agenda for the London recovery. Howver I strongly believe it needs to be more radical and urgent. We should aim to be a pollution free city by 2025, and a zero waste city by the same date or 2030 at...

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I am glad that a Green New Deal is on the agenda for the London recovery. Howver I strongly believe it needs to be more radical and urgent. We should aim to be a pollution free city by 2025, and a zero waste city by the same date or 2030 at the latest. With the IPCC report suggesting that, at the current time of writing, we now have less than 10 years to mitigate the climate crisis, any laters later are too late.

Furthermore, a Green New Deal should not be a 'separate' mission to every other mission London is embarking on. A Green New Deal should be implemented within, and inform, every future action going forward that the Mayor of London actions. We cannot advance other areas (such as digital accessibility, economy, jobs) without the Green New Deal working *inside* of these other missions. The planet is already dying and London is a huge contributor. This is an emergency. 

 

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