Sensor data
How do you feel about gathering and using data with sensor technology?
Sensor data is data collected by a device that detects and responds to a physical environment, for example detecting free car parking spaces or usage of parks.
Sensors in the public domain give us more data about how people live, work and visit the city.
How do you feel about gathering and using data in this way? What do you think are the benefits? What concerns do you have?
The discussion ran from 13 March 2018 - 14 September 2018
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Log into your accountBattleAxeN17
Community Member 6 years agoIn principle gathering anonymous sensor data to provide real time information could be useful. However trust of governments is low and the recent scandal involving facebook and Cambridge Analytica shows how supposedly anonymous or...
Show full commentIn principle gathering anonymous sensor data to provide real time information could be useful. However trust of governments is low and the recent scandal involving facebook and Cambridge Analytica shows how supposedly anonymous or confidential information can be misused.
Show less of commentSpawater
Community Member 6 years agoThe anonymous Official Representative asks us what we think are the benefits. Not benefits and drawbacks. This person inadvertently or deliberately biases his/her/bot question. Not a good omen. Checking car park spaces seems harmless enough...
Show full commentThe anonymous Official Representative asks us what we think are the benefits. Not benefits and drawbacks. This person inadvertently or deliberately biases his/her/bot question. Not a good omen. Checking car park spaces seems harmless enough; thin edge of a totalitarian wedge?
Show less of commentFull disclosure is required for us to arrive at an informed opinion. Until then, safest to oppose it.
Talk London
Official Representative 6 years agoHi Spawater
Thanks for your comment.
We're keen to find out what Londoners think about sensor data, positive or negative. That's why we ask them what they think the benefits are, and whether they have concerns.
How would you like sensor data to be used?
Talk London
Anonymous - account deleted
Community Member 6 years agoPoint proven by the backpedaling response from ‘talk london’ . How about we discuss how many other schemes were pushed through under the guise of being for the publics benefit but that once implemented are now used to penalise people and...
Show full commentPoint proven by the backpedaling response from ‘talk london’ . How about we discuss how many other schemes were pushed through under the guise of being for the publics benefit but that once implemented are now used to penalise people and invade their privacy or extort them.
Show less of commentAnonymous - account deleted
Community Member 6 years agoIn line with similar comments...it really depends upon the type of data collected, and how it will be used in the longer term. The question is indeed too broad.
johnmooren
Community Member 6 years agoIt makes perfect sense to collect data that does not identify individual people and use it to improve services, infrastructure, safety, etc. That data can even be sold on an aggregated level, again to improve services, infrastructure, etc...
Show full commentIt makes perfect sense to collect data that does not identify individual people and use it to improve services, infrastructure, safety, etc. That data can even be sold on an aggregated level, again to improve services, infrastructure, etc. It would be a disservice to the community not to use this kind of technology.
Of course the collector of the data needs to take all reasonable precautions to protect the data from unauthorised access and fallback mechanisms need to be in place for failure of data collection where we rely on sensors - e.g. traffic lights should still work even when sensors controlling them fail.
Show less of commentAnonymous - account deleted
Community Member 6 years agoAs long as the sensor data is restricted to environmental information (noise levels, air quality, etc.) and does not allow video or voice capture, then I can see benefit in it. The parameters regarding what data can be collected need to be...
Show full commentAs long as the sensor data is restricted to environmental information (noise levels, air quality, etc.) and does not allow video or voice capture, then I can see benefit in it. The parameters regarding what data can be collected need to be tightly controlled with public input to any decisions about changes.
Show less of commentAnonymous - account deleted
Community Member 6 years agoSensors that help us - nearest bus stop with bus going in my next destination direction, closest parking place, nearest A&E with shortest queue accounting for time to get there, etc etc. are to be welcomed, but collecting/monitoring...
Show full commentSensors that help us - nearest bus stop with bus going in my next destination direction, closest parking place, nearest A&E with shortest queue accounting for time to get there, etc etc. are to be welcomed, but collecting/monitoring personal data is definitely off-limits whether by the sensor computer system or the smart device used to benefit from the sensors
Blanket rejection of sensors is puerile and absurdist, pwerhaps Luddite-like!
Show less of commentAnonymous - account deleted
Community Member 6 years agoThe problem is the dishonesty surrounding the intended use of these sensors, we will be told they are for one thing that perhaps benefits us, then after they are installed and in use they will be used to spy on us, monitor us, penalise us...
Show full commentThe problem is the dishonesty surrounding the intended use of these sensors, we will be told they are for one thing that perhaps benefits us, then after they are installed and in use they will be used to spy on us, monitor us, penalise us and profit from us. Have we learnt nothing about the underhand tactics of these extortionists by now. Just look back at traffic monitoring cameras , now being used to issue you a fine for having a wheel in a bus lane after pulling around a turning vehicle or moving out of a police or ambulances way ... I think to ignore the history of underhanded tactics is both foolish and ill informed.
Show less of commentAnonymous - account deleted
Community Member 6 years agoNow that you mention it, Tradesman, I wouldn't mind a fine or two for the Deliveroo cyclists who use the pavement as a cycle path and speed through red lights. Also, I'd like something to be done about drivers who drive into the pedestrian...
Show full commentNow that you mention it, Tradesman, I wouldn't mind a fine or two for the Deliveroo cyclists who use the pavement as a cycle path and speed through red lights. Also, I'd like something to be done about drivers who drive into the pedestrian crossing and block it while waiting at a red light.
Show less of commentcommonsense
Community Member 6 years agoAs long as it's sensible data being collected I'm fine with that. However, the technology used can't be harmful, e.g. microwaves beaming nonstop the whole area like the "great" smart meters must be avoided!
Anonymous - account deleted
Community Member 6 years agoAnd who's paying for all this technology? Why can't the money be spent on our police and public transport instead?
What we really need is more police. Priorities, please.
Anonymous - account deleted
Community Member 6 years agoIt would very much depend on what information the sensors are collecting. Data regarding rainfall, parking spaces and sunlight are fine, however, any data collected regarding human activity would have to be collected in a consensual manner...
Show full commentIt would very much depend on what information the sensors are collecting. Data regarding rainfall, parking spaces and sunlight are fine, however, any data collected regarding human activity would have to be collected in a consensual manner, ensuring that everyone taking part agrees to be tracked in such a way.
I do feel that, used correctly, sensor data can benefit a city, providing important information that could augment our lives, reduce waste and streamline efficiency. However, safeguards need to be made clear, so that the data is only used to benefit people, and not used to capitalise against them.
Show less of commentAnonymous - account deleted
Community Member 6 years agoCollecting anonymous data is absolutely fine.
LondonAndy70
Community Member 6 years agoI'm fine with this so long as the data-gathering is made public, is aggregated, and for a specific, transparent purpose that is for the public good (ie NOT Facebook / Cambridge Analytica!).
rogersjrt
Community Member 6 years agoAgreed, GDPR standards must be kept to, even after we leave the EU.
Anonymous - account deleted
Community Member 6 years agoData-gathering is never squeaky clean. There is always the temptation to sell it. There are always hackers and rogue employees.
I earn money doing market research surveys. That is selling my data. Thing is, I'm the one in control....
Show full commentData-gathering is never squeaky clean. There is always the temptation to sell it. There are always hackers and rogue employees.
I earn money doing market research surveys. That is selling my data. Thing is, I'm the one in control.
I'm not so keen on sensors in public spaces because that is an invasion of my privacy, over which I have no control. Parks should be a tech-free zone.
I might change my mind if City Hall paid me for each time I passed a sensor! But I know that's not going to happen.
Show less of commentAnonymous - account deleted
Community Member 6 years agoI think people are misunderstanding what this means. "Sensor" data does not equal video cameras. I feel that the question is too broad and am unable to then write an appropriate response. I therefore will address the one example given, I...
Show full commentI think people are misunderstanding what this means. "Sensor" data does not equal video cameras. I feel that the question is too broad and am unable to then write an appropriate response. I therefore will address the one example given, I feel perfectly fine about sensors gathering data about free car parking spaces if it is merely a pressure sensor or something like that. I think sensor data where there is no information that can be used to identify the individuals is fine. Same goes for usage of parks, if it is merely a motion sensor perhaps that just "counts" as people enter or exit that is perfectly fine. However, if you are using cameras to then figure out if it is children, adults, etc and this data can be used to identify individuals, that is getting to be a bit invasive. Also important to note that this would only apply to the PUBLIC domain. Obviously gathering sensor data from private areas is completely unacceptable without express permission from each individual.
Show less of commentAnonymous - account deleted
Community Member 6 years agoThere might be some merit in gathering data about free parking spaces (although I think we ought to discourage car use), but I don't feel at all comfortable about sensors in parks. If the powers that be want to know who's using our parks...
Show full commentThere might be some merit in gathering data about free parking spaces (although I think we ought to discourage car use), but I don't feel at all comfortable about sensors in parks. If the powers that be want to know who's using our parks, can't they pay a visit once in a while?
How would you feel if you slept on a park bench and a sensor was installed to tell the authorities whether you were still there at 3am?
Show less of commentAnonymous - account deleted
Community Member 6 years agoI would agree with Pandazaur's comments. The question is certainly too broad.
Moreover, I would extend the above comments to say that any organisation that would gather identifiable data about citizens would be liable to prosecution under...
Show full commentI would agree with Pandazaur's comments. The question is certainly too broad.
Moreover, I would extend the above comments to say that any organisation that would gather identifiable data about citizens would be liable to prosecution under data confidentiality law.
I would then expect the Mayor's Office to back up any complaints from citizens and support any legal action against private companies flouting these rights of citizens.
Show less of commentAnonymous - account deleted
Community Member 6 years agoI am fine with it as long as the following conditions are met:
Show full comment1. the scope of data collection is transparent and publicly known
2. the usage of data is transparent and publicly known
3. the data are not shared with other institutions...
I am fine with it as long as the following conditions are met:
Show less of comment1. the scope of data collection is transparent and publicly known
2. the usage of data is transparent and publicly known
3. the data are not shared with other institutions, especially commercial companies
Michael_Young
Community Member 6 years agoAgreed !
rogersjrt
Community Member 6 years agoIndeed, and under new GDPR regulations they would have to be, as it would be scandalous and fairly impossible to get total informed consent on any use that was not very specific and known widely.
Anonymous - account deleted
Community Member 6 years agoBig brother prying where it isn't wanted
LondonAndy70
Community Member 6 years agoSo if you were a car driver, and this data gathering could tell you where there was an empty car parking space you wouldn't be interested in data gathering?
Anonymous - account deleted
Community Member 6 years agoThis is exactly like the novel 1984. Or, for older Londoners, The Prisoner.
Anonymous - account deleted
Community Member 6 years agoI think you may find that the novel predates the TV programme but I know what you mean
Anonymous - account deleted
Community Member 6 years agoWhat's wrong with my comment? I don't know what's objectionable about it.
I tell you what IS objectionable, though. Sensors on park benches, spying on us through our phones, sensors on our high streets...
Why can't the Mayor just...
Show full commentWhat's wrong with my comment? I don't know what's objectionable about it.
I tell you what IS objectionable, though. Sensors on park benches, spying on us through our phones, sensors on our high streets...
Why can't the Mayor just invest in our high streets and parks?
Show less of comment