Question and Answer Session: London's Economic Recovery and Business (Supplementary) [6]

Rajesh Agrawal (Deputy Mayor for Business):  That is more for the Deputy Mayor for Transport than myself, but I know that the Mayor is trying.  TfL is in a very difficult place right now with its finances, and I know the difficult situation they are in.  As part of the Government’s funding arrangement, they had to quickly fasten their process of turnaround, which is why we are having these challenges with the unions which the Mayor is trying to address.  I would defer this to the Deputy Mayor for Transport. 

Keith Prince AM (Deputy Chairman):  Obviously, we are talking about London’s finances.  The fact that there is a strike today, there was a strike on Tuesday [1 March 2022] and there will be more strikes is desperately affecting London’s economy.  Do you think the Mayor was wise to ignore the advice of TfL managers and insist on this inflation‑busting pay rise?  Do you think that was a sensible thing to do, to put TfL’s finances in an even worse position? 

Rajesh Agrawal (Deputy Mayor for Business):  The Mayor is the Chair of TfL and then you have the Deputy Mayor for Transport, who sits on the Board of TfL.  It is better that they answer that, and I am happy for the Deputy Mayor for Transport to answer this. 

Keith Prince AM (Deputy Chairman):  OK.  In your answer to my colleague earlier, you tried to muddy the water by taking away the number of days and using number of hours lost in relation to strikes, but, of course, it was Sadiq Khan who set the Sadiqian scale on days.  He said, back in December 2016, that Ken’s [Livingstone, former Mayor of London] 16 days of strike was too many and that Boris’ [Johnson MP, former Mayor of London] 35 days of strikes was a disgrace.  That again is referring to days, so the Sadiqian scale is about days.  We now know that the aggregate number of strikes under Boris and Ken is 51, and we now have had 52 days of strikes under Sadiq Khan.  Could you perhaps advise me on the Sadiqian scale?  If 16 is too many and 35 is a disgrace, what is 52 on the Sadiqian scale? 

Rajesh Agrawal (Deputy Mayor for Business):  I am not going to get into numbers again, but what I will tell you is that the number of days lost in strike is about a 70% reduction compared to the previous Mayor, so that is a lot.  At the same time, this is all pre‑COVID and we are in a very different situation now.  That is why the Government must work with the Mayor towards a longer‑term funding deal for TfL to save some of these things.  A lot of these things are emerging from the Mayor’s conversations with the Government and the Government’s conditions for funding TfL. 

Keith Prince AM (Deputy Chairman):  Can you tell me, you are the Deputy Mayor for Business, did you have trouble getting in today?  Is it because of the strikes you were not in today? 

Rajesh Agrawal (Deputy Mayor for Business):  I do not particularly see that making any difference to our conversation, that I am doing it remotely. 

Keith Prince AM (Deputy Chairman):  You are the Deputy Mayor, and Amy Lamé has managed to make it in ‑ in fact, Amy Lamé is the only member here today who has agreed to be with us for the entirety of the meeting, so thank you for that, Amy ‑ but you cannot even be bothered to come in.  That is showing absolute disrespect for this body, but I am going to leave it there because I want to ask Amy a quick question. 

Rajesh Agrawal (Deputy Mayor for Business):  If I may, I think it is inappropriate to make comments depending on where people live.  It is not right to compare that, but we will leave it there.  I think it is an unfair comment. 

Andrew Boff AM (Chair):  It is quite appropriate to ask a question about why you are not here, and that is what the Assembly Member has done. 

Rajesh Agrawal (Deputy Mayor for Business):  I appreciate the asking of the question why I am not here, but I am saying I am present remotely and that is perfectly fine. 

Keith Prince AM (Deputy Chairman):  Why are you not here, though? 

Rajesh Agrawal (Deputy Mayor for Business):  We have just discussed this, essentially, that there is a Tube strike and there is disruption because of that. 

Keith Prince AM (Deputy Chairman):  But I understand that you were offered a lift in.  You were offered a lift.  Assembly Member Susan Hall not only brought herself in, she brought two other Members in.  She lives just down the road from you, she went straight past your front door, effectively, and you decided to decline that very kind offer.  Why are you not here? 

Rajesh Agrawal (Deputy Mayor for Business):  Chair, I am not sure who went past my front door and I am not comfortable with this conversation.

Keith Prince AM (Deputy Chairman):  I will leave it there, but I do want to ask Amy a quick question.  First of all, Amy, thank you so much for making the effort to come in.  We really appreciate that, thank you.  Also, thank you for the help you gave me in Redbridge some time ago, I appreciate that too.  Do you think that the fact we no longer have a Night Tube is affecting the night‑time economy? 

Amy Lamé (Night Czar):  Thank you very much, Assembly Member Prince, and it is always a pleasure to appear in front of the Assembly.  I will say I did make it here on one of the new fully electric 63 buses which are under threat because we need a sustainable financial deal from central Government for TfL.  If we would like to see those innovations improve travel around London, we would need a sustainable financial deal from central Government for TfL. 

When it comes to the Night Tube, it is interesting that you say that because I have the latest figures just in front of me.  Despite current Night Tube strikes, Londoners are actually going out in bigger and bigger numbers at night.  We are seeing numbers going up, with Victoria line ridership at nearly 70% of pre‑pandemic levels on 26 February [2022].  Despite the strikes, we were seeing a very good service on the Night Tube.  It is interesting to see how the ridership has changed.  The latest snapshot during the day on an average Thursday, for example, was at 68% of normal demand.  We are seeing an increase in demand, and this is why we need a proper, sustainable financial deal from central Government for TfL.  There can be no UK recovery from the pandemic without a London recovery, and there is no London recovery without a properly funded transport network in the capital, and that lies with central Government. 

Keith Prince AM (Deputy Chairman):  OK.  I am going to leave it there, thank you.